PodcastThe Real Investment ShowLance Roberts

9-3-26 Is the Stock Market Expensive or Cheap?

The discussion weighs AI’s economic promise against its infrastructure demands, with electricity, data-center investment, commercial adoption, and AI-related capital expenditures shaping growth. It also examines a weak labor market, oil- and war-related inflation, differing Federal Reserve rate-hike odds, and the Treasury’s upcoming buyback operation. Market leadership has rotated toward value and defensive stocks, while elevated valuations, inexpensive hedges, and upward earnings revisions frame the outlook for returns. The speakers see potential for a momentum rebound toward year-end but expect high valuations to weigh on average 10-year returns and S&P earnings growth to slow to roughly 10%–11% during 2027–2029.

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Key Takeaways

The speakers linked AI investment directly to current economic activity: AI-related capital expenditures were said to account for all of approximately 1.5% GDP growth, while corporate borrowing to build data centers was supporting GDP and allowing lenders to charge higher rates. Commercial adoption is already broad—more than 50% of small businesses, 62% of medium-sized businesses, and 66.5% of large businesses—but electricity constraints and the need for AI-generated revenue to exceed spending remain key limitations.

The discussion challenged the case for tightening monetary policy into the current environment: recent inflation was characterized as primarily an oil- and war-related supply shock that rate hikes would not resolve, while the labor market showed weakness through 80,000 downward job revisions, roughly 30,000–35,000 average monthly job gains, and a participation-rate decline of more than 1%. Market estimates for a Fed hike ranged from roughly 53%–54% to 65%, with the outcome dependent on incoming employment and inflation data.

Markets were showing both enthusiasm for AI-related spending and a defensive, rapidly rotating leadership structure: Snowflake rose 23%–24% after announcing a deal with Amazon, while the broader market remained range-bound and high-beta semiconductor shares stayed under pressure as money moved toward value and defensive stocks.

TECHNOLOGY

AI Infrastructure — AI requires substantial data-center investment before its broader economic benefits appear. Electricity could limit data-center expansion and constrain AI’s economic impact, although some benefits may arrive faster than they did with railroads.

“So the question is when's that you know it's assessing that gap between laying the tracks which is building the data center the AI labs doing their thing and when…”—

ECONOMY

Productive Leverage — Demand for corporate borrowing to build data centers is allowing lenders to charge higher rates, while related capital expenditures are contributing to GDP and economic activity. The speakers argue that leverage can support growth when used for productive investment and kept under control.

“When you have more demand for something, then that gives people the ability to lift prices…”—

Fed Hike Odds — The speakers cited differing market estimates for a Federal Reserve rate hike: roughly 53%–54% and 65% in favor of a hike. They emphasized that the outlook depended on incoming employment and inflation data.

“We've got rate hike odds running about 53 54%. Last time I checked it…”—

Oil Supply Shock — The speakers characterized recent inflation as largely an oil- and war-related supply shock rather than persistent domestic demand. They noted that rate hikes would not affect Iran-driven oil pressures and argued that tightening into a temporary shock could be inappropriate.

“Now, and remember, inflation was on a downward trend before the war, very slow, but downward trend before the war started…”—

MARKETS

Snowflake Rally — Snowflake’s announced deal with Amazon was followed by a reported 23%–24% rise in Snowflake’s stock, reflecting optimism around AI-related deals and spending.

“Snowflake announced a deal with Amazon last night. That stock's up 23 24% this morning…”—

Defensive Rotation — The market had been range-bound for about three months, with leadership rotating rapidly among technology, health care, and other groups. High-beta areas such as semiconductors remained under pressure as money moved toward value and defensive stocks.

“The market really has not done a lot here over the last really three months…”—

Cheap Hedges — Volatility remained compressed even during market weakness, leaving portfolio puts and other hedges relatively inexpensive because demand for protection was limited.

“And if we take a look at things like the volatility index, as we talked about before, that remains very compressed. Putting hedges on portfolios remains extremely cheap…”—

FORECASTS

Momentum Rebound — The momentum ETF MTUM was described as being on a sell signal and deeply oversold. The speakers said momentum could recover toward year-end, but warned that a break below its neckline could lead to a larger decline.

“We're on a sell signal. We're fairly deeply oversold…”—

CAPE Outlook — The Shiller CAPE ratio was described as roughly 39–40, its highest level since the dot-com crisis. The speakers said high valuations imply lower average stock returns over 10 years, potentially around negative 2%, but do not determine the result for every individual year.

“they'll show you a chart of cape valuations, which looks like this. And again, Kate valuations are elevated. We're up to about 40…”—

INTRO

The hosts preview weak JOLTS and ADP employment data, tomorrow’s payrolls report, oil-driven inflation, rate-hike odds, AI deals, and data-center borrowing supporting GDP growth.

Jobs, JOLTS, & Economic Number Previews

The market remains trapped in a consolidation range as leadership rotates from pressured momentum and semiconductor stocks toward value, quality, low-volatility, and defensive areas.

Markets are Stuck

The hosts discuss vacation plans, including an Italy robbery story, family visits, and a Labor Day weekend spent with relatives.

Vacation & Weekend Plans

Warsh faces conflicting rate-hike signals: weak employment argues for restraint, while oil-related bond-yield increases and longer-term inflation concerns complicate the Federal Reserve’s decision.

The Fed: What Will Warsh Do With Rates?

The Treasury’s buyback program has not yet begun, despite commentary claiming it already failed, while oil, AI borrowing, and yen movements pressure bonds.

The Truth About "Fed Buy Backs"

The hosts argue that temporary oil inflation and weaker demand do not justify a rate hike, which could become a symbolic public-relations move rather than fundamental policy.

Inflation Expectations are not Reason to Raise Rates

Market-based five- and ten-year inflation expectations remain below prewar levels, while employment is weak enough that Fed objectives arguably favor considering cuts instead of hikes.

No Guidance from the Fed?

Markets are adjusting to less Federal Reserve guidance, with Warsh quiet while other officials offer conflicting hawkish and dovish policy views.

Valuations - What We Know vs What We Think We Know

Elevated CAPE valuations indicate weaker average ten-year returns but are poor short-term timing tools and do not, by themselves, signal an imminent crash.

It all Comes Down to AI

The valuation debate ultimately depends on whether AI delivers broad economic benefits beyond Nvidia and other infrastructure leaders, and how quickly electricity and data-center constraints ease.

The Issue with PEG Ratios

PEG ratios rely on uncertain forward earnings and growth forecasts, appearing historically cheap even as CAPE makes the market look expensive.

Dealing with Earnings Estimates Revisions

AI-driven earnings revisions have moved higher, particularly for semiconductor companies, but expected S&P growth is projected to normalize around 10%–11% during 2027–2029.

How AI is Like the Railroads

AI infrastructure resembles railroad construction: large investment precedes broader productivity gains, although software development and other applications already show meaningful benefits.

The Use of AI is Growing

More than half of U.S. small businesses and roughly two-thirds of larger businesses use AI, generating current revenue while improving productivity and research efficiency.

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Important Disclaimers

Not Investment Advice: For education only — not financial, tax or legal advice.

AI-Generated: Made by AI from source transcripts and may contain errors.

No Guarantees: Past performance does not predict future results; investing carries risk.

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