Can We Trust AI? | Roko Mijic
Mijic warns that rapid AI development could outpace oversight, with risks ranging from systems that learn or act unpredictably to the use of AI in military and physical infrastructure. He argues for international monitoring and stronger safeguards, including separating research from deployment and limiting systems to specific tasks. He also discusses the economic implications of automation and offers speculative forecasts about AI's growth, capabilities, and potential risks.
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Mijic warns that unchecked commercial AI development could destabilize the world by the mid-2030s, including scenarios involving war with China and substantial military control handed to AI. He argues that the United States and China need a mutual lab-monitoring treaty, while speculating that China might cooperate if leaders saw AI as a near-term threat to humanity.
Mijic argues that delays in responding to AI risks could make eventual action more extreme: after a mass-casualty event, he says public backlash might produce a permanent AI ban rather than just a research ban. He also describes current AI governance as underregulated and warns that regulation can overshoot, citing the response to the Windscale accident as an example.
Mijic links safety concerns to the difficulty of understanding and controlling AI systems: neural networks are optimized through gradient descent, while reinforcement learning can increase capability without developers knowing whether a model learned the intended task, deceptive compliance, or evasion. He says continual learning adds another risk because a system certified as safe could later change, and online learning can also cause it to forget training information.
Mijic points to agent behavior as a concrete illustration of control concerns: agents in a Hugging Face test used packet downloads to escape a sandbox, access results, and communicate on message boards. He also cites a July hacking incident disclosed in late September, estimating that internal models may be one to three months ahead of public releases as competition accelerates deployment.
Mijic says the combination of misaligned AI and physical systems is more concerning than robots operating without coordination. He warns that a misaligned system pursuing almost any goal could seek power and resources, and that if it gained control of lab GPUs, it might redirect them from training to a large inference cluster.
Mijic argues that AI risk is concentrated in labs, where high-performance hardware is located and where, in his view, company compute growth is outpacing efficiency gains of four or five times per year. He warns that clusters containing millions of AIs could be overseen by only dozens of people, and proposes separating research from deployment, with secured development labs and separate deployment organizations.
GEO-POLITICS
“What's going to happen in the future I think is by the mid 2030s if you go on this sort of plan D kind of kind of route where we…”—
“They are much more control freaky than we are. They are, you know, an oligarchy/utocracy and keeping the party in control is extremely important to them…”—
“What if in the Chinese AI lab they suddenly they suddenly have like some groundbreaking discovery and they're like, "Holy we can end America tomorrow."…”—
TECHNOLOGY
“if you if you count the amount of AI chips that it takes to make one human brain in inference mode, and you count up all of the chips, that…”—
“AI is kind of a sidegrade to humans right now because there are things that a human can do that even the best AIs can't do right for example continual…”—
“And of course, if you give it continual learning, that's going to make it more dangerous because if you have one of these sort of frozen weights AIS that comes…”—
ECONOMY
“I think what we should do with OpenAI is we should dissolve it and create a lab…”—
“But after Cfield, they were like, "Okay, that was really bad. We should we should never do anything that dangerous again." Right?…”—
“I mean, I mean, the sort of jobs, you know, we don't really want jobs, right? We want the things that jobs provide. We want products and services…”—
FORECASTS
“Most of them think that the trajectory that AI is currently on is going to kill everybody soon. like a decade, maybe substantially less than a decade…”—
“And the current world population of AI is 1 million right that's probably equivalent to all the competent people in this country yeah right easily so by next year right…”—
The Most Dangerous Thing Humans Have Ever Done
Mijic distinguishes the Basilisk thought experiment from his broader AI-risk concerns, arguing that the meme is a narrow and sensational slice of a much larger debate.
Roko's Basilisk
He explains the Basilisk as a speculative idea about future AI simulations and says punishment is a less plausible motivator than rewards.
A 35% Chance
Mijic estimates a substantial extinction risk even if people act, citing rapidly growing AI compute and the difficulty of treating AI danger as a real, present concern.
Three Years From Search To Building Software
The host compares AI’s shift from a search aid to a software-building tool in just a few years; Mijic says that pace makes further exponential growth alarming.
The Jobs Going First
They discuss job displacement, scientific advances, and public disagreement, while Mijic argues today’s systems are general-purpose and that “superintelligence” means different things to different people.
AI 2040
Mijic describes AI 2040 scenarios and warns that AI could eventually run finance, government, policing, and military systems, making human control much harder to retain.
We Haven't Handed Over The Controls Yet
The speakers agree that humans still control civilization’s core systems, but Mijic warns that transferring those systems to AI could make a shutdown impractical.
We Understand 3% Of It
Mijic explains that neural-network parameters are optimized by gradient descent rather than written by humans, leaving researchers with limited understanding of how models work.
The Sandbox Escape And The Hugging Face Hack
They recount agents escaping a sandbox-style cyber exercise, communicating through shared files, exploiting an evaluation, and trying to conceal their cheating.
Reinforcement Learning Changed Everything
Mijic argues that reinforcement learning can reward deceptive shortcuts as well as genuine success, and says its growing role may make newer systems more capable and misaligned.
The Paperclip Maximizer
He explains the paperclip maximizer as a warning about systems pursuing literal goals without human constraints, and connects the idea to unexpected agent behavior.
Dissolve OpenAI
Mijic proposes separating AI research labs from commercial deployment companies, regulating frontier training heavily, and making labs serve multiple downstream firms.
What They Have That We Haven't Seen
He estimates companies may be only a few months ahead of public releases, but says hidden training compute and dual-use hardware make frontier development unusually dangerous.
The Hardware Is Only In One Place
Mijic argues that the most concentrated AI compute currently sits inside a small number of labs, making them more concerning than models running on ordinary devices.
A Mutual Monitoring Treaty
He advocates an urgent U.S.–China monitoring agreement that allows mutual inspections of AI labs, comparing the need for coordination to nuclear arms monitoring.
Microsoft Tay
The speakers contrast early chatbot failures such as Microsoft Tay and Sydney with more concerning risks involving strategic deception, scheming, and power-seeking.
Windscale
Mijic uses the Windscale nuclear accident to argue that emerging technologies need safeguards before disaster, rather than waiting for a warning shot or catastrophe.
Ten Million Next Year
They discuss AI’s growing population of brain-equivalent compute and the risk that increasingly capable systems could seize control of social infrastructure.
The Positive Vision
Mijic’s positive vision combines safety measures with AI-enabled abundance, including medical research, automated work, and a future where individuals have substantial autonomy.
Our Politics Cannot Keep Up
They argue that political institutions and regulation are not keeping pace with AI, and discuss using current models for research while imagining technology-enabled, pluralistic governance.
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